Transcript
Derek Ferrell (00:00) hey, Brandon. How are you?
Brandon Chase (00:01) Hey, how’s it going? Sorry, I’m late. I was running over on a call.
Derek Ferrell (00:05) No worries. I was making sure something wasn’t wrong on mine. I was sitting there waiting and it took forever for it to fire up too. The system’s been so isolated.
Brandon Chase (00:13) Yeah, that’s weird. That’s weird.
Derek Ferrell (00:16) How are you doing?
Brandon Chase (00:18) Good, man. I’m good. You know, obviously, you’ve heard the news about fletcher.
Derek Ferrell (00:24) Yep. So.
Brandon Chase (00:25) I’m good. I mean, just the question is like, how are you doing? I feel really bad that I was like, I’m pestering this Guy and he just went through like one of the hardest things in his life, so, I.
Derek Ferrell (00:37) apologize man. No, it’s okay. I mean, it’s I mean, just good days and bad days. Certainly nothing to like make it easy. I think if anything, you know, one person, you know, everybody’s like, you know, if there’s anything I can do for, you know, please let me know. I’m like, well, the one thing that I want like no one can do. So, I mean, if anything just like buy me a beer, you know, like if you’re a friend like locally, you know, like just that’s about all you can do because it’s like there’s like nothing else. So certainly not for one. Like there was no prep for this. It was out of the blue. He just had a massive stroke and kind of the symptoms behind it too because like, he was up here, he was working in a condo not to get too much into it. He was working in their condo literally like three Miles from my house, their beach condo. I didn’t know he was in town. They were working really busy to get it sold. It was a rental that they had had and it had just kind of been a nightmare in a money pit. They were trying to get out of town and had been working on it for like 10 days, wasn’t feeling his best. And he’s like, I think I’m going to head home and they think that he probably wasn’t feeling his best because he probably had started to have like many strokes. And then he starts driving home. I don’t check on him because I’m like, well, of course, mom will see him on the other side in Tampa. So like, against my better judgment, I don’t check on him. And then I didn’t know mom was traveling for work. So mom was traveling. And then he left, this was Monday. Two weeks ago. He left. And then on the road like really started feeling bad and had the wherewithal to like pull off and pass just like literally outside his car in a public park. He went to go to the bathroom and just passed massive stroke. And it’s like in a town, nobody knew him, not around any of us. Mom didn’t know until later when she landed and was like, where’s dad? And then, so she’s looking for him. We don’t know where he is. And they finally found him. I found out Wednesday of two weeks ago.
Derek Ferrell (02:30) That was when I found out. And yeah, so it’s just been a nightmare but, you know, it is what it is. We only have a fixed amount of time on this planet and nobody gets to be here. Forever. And you never know, like tomorrow could be your last, you never know. So yeah, it is what it is. We spent some time. He liked fishing. I went fishing through a line out, didn’t catch crap, but it was good to just, you know, do it. He liked grilling. So I grilled the steak. He liked bananas, foster, I’ve never made it before but I’ve made it for my family and I, and we just said, you know, this one’s for you. Yeah, and just spent time with the kids and they don’t really understand because they’re four and two. So they don’t yeah, they just think he’s like at the beach. My oldest is like, but it’s good. He’s with Jesus and that means I can see him too, and I’m like, yes, but that’s like a long time for now especially for you. So I think it’s great that you’d say that, but I don’t think she understands yet. So, yeah, it was tough. I took off last week, I knew, and they were done with the investigation because they found him in a public park and, you know, kind of all that song and dance too. So we just did the celebration of life and then all the siblings. My sister couldn’t come in. All the siblings are hopefully going to get together here in like the next two months. My sister was just really sick so she couldn’t travel in from California. And so we were like, well, let’s just do something small and then we’ll once everyone can kind of digest and be in a better space.
Derek Ferrell (04:02) We’ll do something. But no, I saw, you know, passed everything kind of off to Gail while I was out and he was, you know, apprised of the situation kind of in advance. I know there was some like last minute kind of back and forth between the executives on our end as well and questions and concerns and employee, you know, how much is this going to draw the team down? How much, you know, versus not, what kind of protocols are we going to put in place because it’s definitely going to be one of those like once we know medallion’s operating to X level, then we can draw down to y level?
Brandon Chase (04:35) Right.
Derek Ferrell (04:37) Talked with Gail this morning just to catch up on everything from being out last week. And, you know, the one thing we want to really kind of work out and get in place is, you know, what does the implementation plan look like? Let’s get that hashed out? Let’s go ahead and start figuring out the exact dates times, you know, gate checks, what do we want to hit before we go to the next gate? Check with the end goal in mind, we do want this to be, you know, we want it in as quickly as possible, of course. And I know everyone says that, but at the same time, we want it to be as integrated through API as possible as well. So the end goal is even if we have to take a little longer to get there, you know, that’s certainly something that is not just like on the road map. It’s like that is what we want because that’s what we need in order to really ensure that our, sorry, I’ve got one heck of an itch in my nose in order to ensure that it’s just set up appropriately. And so, you… know, again, the near term goal would be of course getting like the tool access, right? Just so we can start to work through the backlog. We can do that stuff, start to draw a line in the sand and say, hey, from this date, everything new prospective is now just going through medallion, right? And we can at least start to offload that and then say, okay, now, what are the toll gates and who? I already kind of have a general idea on my end on who I need to pull in, but who do we need to pull in from your end? To have those conversations surrounding the apis, the backends, what you guys need to see the data transfer on all of our prospective data. You know, all of our or I should say historic data, what format you guys need it in? So I can get that, go ahead and put in the data request to our team, get that going, you know, perfect world. I would have already had that but also didn’t have full approval yet from, but didn’t so again, it was kind of hanging there in limbo for a bit… but I would have already started that two weeks ago in advance of a signature date. But again, given what it was, it is what it is, we got it signed. So that’s kind of all that matters.
Brandon Chase (06:46) Yeah, yeah, no, dude. I appreciate, you know, doing all that you did, you know, to get it where we’re at. So yeah, I do think there’s a couple of things you know, that I wanted to cover today. One was… I mean, I’m looking at, I’m looking at a call that we had, I think on October and you were talking to caqh about getting your po account. Has that, have you gotten that yet? Has that been set up?
Derek Ferrell (07:13) I paused it. Yeah. So, we did not get it set up and we paused that just because we could get it through medallion. And so that was one of those, we made the business decision on our end. And I did tell this to fletcher. We made the business decision on our end to go ahead and just pursue through medallion for now and then basically make that decision once we’re implemented not let that take away because they told me that implementing caqh, that our representative there would be like six months to a year at least for us to get it. And I was like,
Brandon Chase (07:49) who were you talking to?
Derek Ferrell (07:51) What was her name Warren?
Brandon Chase (07:52) Was it Warren?
Derek Ferrell (07:54) No, give me a second. I can pull it up. I’ve never talked to her before, but she’s apparently like a senior manager… Etta lambert and I’ll tell you it was not a great interaction between us because literally first interaction, she said, what do you guys do? Where’s your business kind of break? Is it workers’ comp or group health? I went through the whole song and dance and she legitimately said, well, we can only represent your group health side. And I said, I don’t understand that. So you’re telling me you have an exclusive arrangement with someone on the workers’ comp space because that makes no sense.
Derek Ferrell (08:30) Caqh works with everybody. I’ve never seen you guys have an exclusive arrangement. And then she ended up kind of walking out of that call next day and came back and said, yeah, technically speaking, we had a exclusive arrangement with one call and it was signed in 1996. I think it was or seven. And so, yeah, we can only do your group health side. I was like, well, that’s the case. Then I’ll just go through a credentialing vendor and they will have access to everything. They wouldn’t even they wouldn’t even let us roster any of, our workers’ comp side. And then she finally came back maybe November, December and was like, well, we can, but it’s going to be at least like six to 12 months to get you set up. And I was like, well, then we’re just not going to touch that for now. So if that changes, I mean, the goal would be eventually we get it, but certainly at the beginning, I don’t want anything to be held up. We’ll just use yours. I understand. We did something kind of similar at Troy and I know that there’s the once they’re rostered on yours, you know, the annual rostering, if we got ours, we’d have to pay for the annual rostering again. I understand that. I know leadership already understands that here, but it’s more just the smoothest and you just, yeah, okay. Well.
Brandon Chase (09:46) Yeah. And I don’t know how in detail you got with fletcher, but basically like you’re essentially, you’re paying the same thing like it’s a one to one with medallion it’s.
Derek Ferrell (09:56) Just a pass through. Yeah, like.
Brandon Chase (09:58) We don’t upcharge or anything like that. So, you know, it’s a pass through fee. Yep. And then Scott used to work at caqh, that’s why I was curious who it was.
Derek Ferrell (10:10) Yeah. Etta lambert. Okay. Was working with?
Brandon Chase (10:15) Yeah, it’s not. I mean, it’s not something that we need to like. We don’t need to tackle that right now, but I’ll bring it up to Scott because that’s very interesting that she would say that.
Derek Ferrell (10:24) Region inside sales manager, Etta lambert. And that’s what she told me. She was like, yeah, it’s because this exclusive arrangement, it’s causing all this. We don’t just really don’t like workers’ comp at all outside of one call and Dah. And I was like, I don’t know why you’d turn away 42,000 providers, but that’s on you. Okay. Yeah, like it just seems crazy talk to me, right?
Brandon Chase (10:45) That is crazy talk. All right. Cool. Yeah. We, we checked in internally because, you know, as you can imagine, I’ve been kind of, I’ve been talking to, we have like a, you know, a channel dedicated to homelink and we’re talking all things homelink with your team. Yeah. And somebody had brought up all like, what about caqh? I was like, well, they’re going to, you know, they’re going to use us for now but they’re going to eventually get on their own.
Derek Ferrell (11:11) Yeah. And,
Brandon Chase (11:12) you know, of course, everyone starts kind of freaking out a little bit like, well, what about it’s? Expensive and I’m like it’s the same cost as if they were to go directly to caqh.
Derek Ferrell (11:21) And it is expensive and I’ve already heard some of the costs of that and leadership’s aware, you know, again, I was like this isn’t cheap guys. Like it’s expensive to get access to it. And again, we’ll probably make the business decision too. Like do we, do we need to roster everybody right of the 42,000? Probably not like there’s some line in there like home mod, vehicle, mod, like those kind of guys, do we need to roster them? I don’t know we can talk about it like, do we really need them, you know, or do we just run them through the tool and really kind of check like sanctions, oig, that kind of stuff because they’re not actual medical providers, right? Do those need to roster probably not, and that saves money, but we already knew that this is something that we’d have to do because again, in like physical therapy and some of these others, you have to do that and we should really just be doing that and leveraging that all the time. So, yeah, again, the meantime, we’d be using yours. And then again, if I don’t need to work with Etta, you know, we’ll figure that out. But when she told me they had an exclusive and they just really weren’t looking and then she followed up with me maybe a month ago, I was like just not right now. Let’s get the, he missed the boat.
Brandon Chase (12:31) He missed.
Derek Ferrell (12:32) The boat. Yeah. Let’s get medallion in and done and let’s figure the rest out because there’s just no reason to do that now and then pay the extra fee on their end to still be in and I don’t know how it could take that long. I think Troy took 30 days. When we got our setup. It wasn’t very, that just sounds.
Brandon Chase (12:49) crazy. And maybe I wonder if she was like thinking in her head maybe the exclusive ends in 12 months or something.
Derek Ferrell (12:57) Right. Well, and that’s the thing and I asked that too because once I found out there was an exclusive because I could tell by the way she was talking, well, we just don’t work at all in workers’ comp. I was like there ain’t no way that cqh doesn’t work. No. So you have an exclusive. So who’s it with? Because again, it’s either going to be onecall or medris. You’re not doing it with anyone else because they don’t represent enough. And if you had to pick at a two, you’d pick onecall because they represent way more than medris. So I was like, so clearly it’s with medris. It is basically like I can neither confirm nor deny that kind of thing. And then she came back later and it was an in perpetuity agreement like never term, no term limits, no, anything just till the end of time. And both of the people both at caqh and onecall that signed it are fully retired, not even in either company anymore. And some of the people in both organizations didn’t even know that it was still in play. So I was like, well, it sounds like you need a fee and that might be the six months to 12 months, like to get that termed to make sure they didn’t breach to then get us going. But in the meantime, it would still mean we couldn’t use caqh for six months to 12 months and we would be leveraging yours. So likely, what I would do is we get it set up through you guys. We roster the first year. It is magic wand, right? We roster the first year with you guys, it’s passed through to us. And then basically because you’re re, rostering every year with caqh, we try to time it to where if it rolls in the next year, you know, hopefully ours could be up and running. And then we just don’t re, roster with you guys through caqh through yours. And then we give you access to our caqh account at that, which is how you typically operate. Yeah, and we would work, that wouldn’t be one sided. That would be us working with, you know, figure out what works best there. Yeah.
Brandon Chase (14:41) I was going to say, exactly. Yeah, you’re not going to be making that decision in a vacuum, right? It’ll be like it’ll be our teams working together to figure out when that.
Derek Ferrell (14:47) Cutover happens. It’s fast because it’s the same cost. Either way, it’s just which door you’re walking through to get there. Is it your door or ours? Is it you walking through ours or us through yours? You know, that’s all it is.
Brandon Chase (15:01) Yep. Yeah. Exactly. Okay. The other thing I think, yeah, we’re good. I think we’re good on the caqh piece. The other thing I wanted to make sure of is I know that you guys because, you know, we talked to other kind of folks that are in a similar situation. There’s a lot of different provider types. Yes. And we, I know, and again, like I swear, the last time that you and I talked was like October 30 first. And then I know that a lot of this stuff, a lot of your conversations were with fletcher. But here’s, what I did know from that call is that, I mean, and that’s how we kind of landed on the volumes that we landed on. And then we accounted for the growth and all that stuff. But there were, there was no dme or home health or transportation. Those were kind of like the three that were sequestered. But then there’s all of these other ones that, you know, we are looking at. And I know the most important thing I think that you kind of were hitting on was like the mid levels, right? Like the NPS and the pas?
Derek Ferrell (16:08) Are they they’re.
Brandon Chase (16:09) still not being credentialed right now, right? Like those are the folks that need to be.
Derek Ferrell (16:13) Credentialed because we do it through the way our system works just to get us back on track in conversations, the way that the system our current system works is we do everything at the facility level. So mind you, that means if I sign Brandon chase PT agency that has 300 PTS. And just for the sake of argument, let’s just say you have one facility, but we’re going to credential that one facility. We’re not actually watching any of those practitioners and truly credentialing them at the practitioner level, which is certain to group health. That’s just flat out a requirement on that end. And the only reason that we haven’t done it that much as well is because primarily our group health business is dme and home health, which doesn’t necessarily matter at the practitioner level, right? It’s service level. Now, the home health, I would argue you’re getting adjacent, you probably should know, and we’ve run into a ton of scenarios where it’s like Brandon chase actually turned in his license six months ago and he’s still practicing and we’ve been leveraging him. And then a payer finds out and it’s like oopsies. And they’re like, well, what are you doing to watch him? We didn’t know because we didn’t you know, catch it on a state a license turning list, which is kind of how we check it now, but we’re not checking like at the individual level, we’re just more checking for flags.
Brandon Chase (17:36) So if you.
Derek Ferrell (17:37) don’t see it and something big doesn’t come up a lot of times these get through, we also see that in translation a lot with the cert numbers. And so that’s a big one like Colorado and California for us. They have to be certified now and it’s just a devil for us to try to track it because we track at the facility level. So now we’re having to come up with they came up with like an internal scraper tool that one of our dev team literally built to go manually use homelink’s login and scrape on a weekly basis. All the cert numbers and make sure they’re still active instead of just credentialing them. And we’d have that, right?
Brandon Chase (18:18) Yeah. With translation, I don’t I’m pretty sure that we, I don’t think we do that with translation.
Derek Ferrell (18:25) Do you not capture translation cert numbers?
Brandon Chase (18:27) I don’t think we do, I think, I don’t think so. I don’t think, I don’t think.
Derek Ferrell (18:32) translation is true. I mean we’ve got our tool that does it otherwise as long as we’re tracking them for like oig, sanctions because they still need to be tracked that way. And I would assume you guys still like do you roster translation providers?
Brandon Chase (18:50) Hold on. I’m just trying to get this translation answered. All I’m finding is stuff on data translation. So it’s all muddled. Yeah, because I’m pretty sure. So we’re talking to another organization. It’s very similar to homelink, not nearly as big, but we’re kind of running into the same stuff of like there’s all the, like you said, like with home health, like there’s some adjacent stuff. So it’s like, well, do they have a license? Like when, where do we go? Verify that license? Like, you know, sometimes it’s not like a full blanket, no, but like, you know, providers like.
Derek Ferrell (19:34) A home health age should be certified. So, mind you, it’s not a license but they have to be certified so, you know, and usually it’s on the agency to keep track of that. But at the same time, the agency had to apply and had to go through some sort of state agency to get it. So that’s one. If doing it. Certainly, on our end, we’d be very interested in figuring out how to tackle that because that’s a huge black eye for us like almost monthly where there’s Brandon chase home health aid stopped, you know, turned in his license in California. Now he’s in Texas. But hey, I was a home health aid. They did. The new agency didn’t do their due diligence, just submit you through. And then now you’re working for us and then it’s like, but you didn’t actually have your cert or you turned it in three months ago, and then you’ve done three months of workforce and then we have to go back in and recoup three months worth of referrals because the payers like they weren’t certified. We’re not paying for it. They have to be certified by law, right? And then homelink eats the difference and we figure it out. But I would assume that you guys would have access through that through something… do?
Brandon Chase (20:38) You have, because… I know I have, I’m looking at like I’m looking at numbers here and they’re like big buckets of, but I’m looking at these and I’m like these volumes are at least like the screenshot that I have are the old way, right? They’re like the like if you, I think Scott talks about this like you’re coming from like a doorknob, right? Like a facility, a doorknob system to go into like a belly button system, right? Like you want to actually credential the literal provider. And I’m looking, I don’t have an npi file. I don’t think I, unless you sent one to fletcher. I never saw an npi file.
Derek Ferrell (21:17) Do you have? And that was because I needed to know what kind of format you guys needed in so that’ll be put through as a data request. So I did tell fletcher if you let me know like what format you needed in. I want to make sure because it’s a big pull for us.
Derek Ferrell (21:34) I don’t want it to be like we’ll just send just the npi’s in this. It’s like, no, give me what you need. And I will put in the formal request. We’ll get you what you need. So, yes, in some instances, you’re right where and even the numbers as I say, so like 42,000 that’s a mix of both facilities and providers. Because then there’s some where we are only tracking facilities. And then there’s some where we’re tracking providers, like home mod, vehicle, mod, physical medicine, right? I’m not, I will track it at the facility level. We credential at the facility level. But the numbers I give you are based on the number of practitioners. And so there’s some of that too. But the 42,000 number is really still about accurate for like total provider count if you would or servicing count however you want to look at it because some are facilities Di, you know, there’s like 2,300 Di facilities in there. There’s some others. And again, those need to be credentialed as well, which right now we credential them as a facility, but we don’t monitor them appropriately. I would argue we don’t credential them appropriately, either likely.
Brandon Chase (22:40) So in your first year, you have basically you have 16,000, 500 credits, right? Correct? So that’s… I think that’s what we’ll want that mpi file for, yeah, determine?
Derek Ferrell (22:58) The recreds versus new additions.
Brandon Chase (23:01) Yeah, yeah. It’s like and you can kind of mix that up however you want, you know what I mean? But it’s credits, right? So it’s like it’s initials. It’s recreds, we’ll figure out who needs to be, you know, initially credentialed, who’s up for recred, what are the provider types we can do today? What are the ones that we can’t do? What are the ones on the roadmap? And then that will help determine because I think you were saying earlier, it’s like we need to figure out like what is this first kind of like tranche of providers that we push the medallion is, so, I.
Derek Ferrell (23:36) think the best.
Brandon Chase (23:37) Way to.
Derek Ferrell (23:37) Do.
Brandon Chase (23:37) that, and,
Derek Ferrell (23:38) more importantly moving forward because we don’t want to do any more on our end, right? Once medallion comes in other than the ones we have to. So like, are there some dme that we should maybe still do? And again, open conversation. I’m not saying, hey, you’re not doing our dme. Our 16,000 home health is about 16, 18,000 give or take. But I know on the home health end, like we run into a ton of issues especially with home health aides, RNS, others where it’s like they turned in their license six months ago. Well, verifycomply on our end, doesn’t notify us when Brandon chase turns it in. It just sends us this huge file. And unless we’re looking for Brandon chase in there… we’re not going to know. And it’s like, so how many do we miss? The answer is a crapload more than I ever want to miss. We shouldn’t miss any. So those likely all need to come in. Now, if it’s this dme company that’s selling a boot that doesn’t even deal with members that much. Do we put them through? Probably not, you know, on the new annual re, cred on the group health side, do we need to probably because we need to now cred annually for dme providers per CMS guidelines that rule went into effect for this year, but that’s probably only for group health, which then means we’re going to have to.
Derek Ferrell (25:01) Figure out like where we draw and that’s going to be an open conversation between us. I don’t think that’s 100 percent necessarily on our end but the translator one too again with cert numbers, I would have to imagine if you guys don’t currently do it and find it.
Derek Ferrell (25:17) I would have to imagine it’s something that you guys could get access to like in an API because it’s just through the state… certification like website like it’s through their state, the same agency websites you go to check like are they certified or licensed in the state as a PT?
Derek Ferrell (25:35) Like it’s the same websites. So it’s just through the, what do they call it? Ola? It’s the office of language and something association Ola, and then each one each state. So like California, I think is cola and then Colorado is ccola or whatever it is there. I would have to imagine that you guys could get access to it. So we’ve got our scraper that’s literally just using the homelink login going in and doing it. And that works for now. But I would have to imagine you guys could and certainly in the I’ll tell you in the workers’ comp space, it would be a huge boon because everybody is having a one hell of a time in the workers’ comp space trying to get the cert numbers to do that. Yeah.
Brandon Chase (26:19) It’s like, you know, there’s two organizations that I’m talking to and it’s like it’s funny because all three of y’all were like coming from this facility level credentialing, and then wanting to move more towards this, I say it’s like more of like a urac process to an mcqa process.
Brandon Chase (26:38) But I mean, that’s oversimplifying it. But yeah, it was like facilities to individual and it’s like it’s your data, I think is much better than what this one other company was. And it was like they don’t even have individual mpis, we had to like literally guess. They just said, you know, what just say for every corp. They call it a corp. Like every corp there’s a three point two, five providers per corp. I’m like that’s the math you want to use. Oh, okay. Like, yeah, like it’s just a guess. It’s just a guess, you know, it’s just.
Derek Ferrell (27:13) Kind of crazy. I can at least get you. I can at least get you. I don’t know if we have, well, I can say with certainty that we don’t have 100 percent of our base like with mpis, right? Like I don’t have an mpi for everybody. But in certain lines of business like physical medicine, the ones that it matters, we have to, it’s part of our cred process to get it. So now we don’t cred them with it, but we collect it. So, and then are putting it into our systems, which is why I say with that data request, if you let me know exactly what you want, I’ll have them go into idgm and it’s literally a corp it poll, they pull a huge report together, pull a SQL, they write all the fields and then they send it to me and then we can say, okay, what do you think? Is this right format? Is it wrong? Is it okay? Can you tweet? Can you do this and they’ll do that? But we have mpis where it’s needed. We may not always have the like the group mpi. Well, actually nine times out of 10, we do because we have that on the contract. So we should have 90 plus percent of them, I would say, and it’s more just getting the data out of it. It’s a rigmarole, but it’s one they can do. And with the implementation kind of around the window, you know, whenever we assign it here, it would be a pretty quick ask. They’d probably get it to me in like three to seven days. I wouldn’t expect more than that maybe so.
Brandon Chase (28:38) What I’ll do is I’ll just, I’ll get the, I’ll get the template for you. Now, you can get ahead of it and make the request. That will kind of speed things up. And we are like right now I’m waiting on one more resource to be assigned. We have, so we have your account manager, your implementation manager, and then we’re waiting on your engagement manager, that’s the last person that we need for the team. What happens from there is once that person is assigned myself and Scott, we do an internal kind of handoff call, right? Like we, they know enough about homelink, but it’s like it’s our opportunity to go like in depth like here’s what they do as a business. And here’s what they need and all this other stuff. And then the… it’s either the engagement manager or the implementation manager. I can’t remember which one now, but one of them reaches out and then schedules the kickoff call with you so that my goal is to get our internal call done this week. And so the next call, the external call theoretically, I’m hoping to get done next week. So, yeah, I’m kind of hammering for the em. Like I said, in the meantime, I’m going to get the template that.
Derek Ferrell (30:08) The team wants, yeah.
Brandon Chase (30:10) I’ll send that over to you. So that way you can make that request.
Derek Ferrell (30:15) Also send me not to cut you off, but send me if you have anything to share. Where it actually, if you have any data sheets, whatever you want to call it. Like even if it’s just like a written document like this is what our API interfaces typically look like. This is where I can start like seeding that because then at least like corp, it corp security kind of all, there’s like three probably dev corp it and corp security are the three kind of groups that I need to wrangle to say, okay, sit down guys. This is the goal. I have my picture chart. This is what we’re doing. You guys need to figure out how to get us from point a to point C now to actually connect them and then they can at least start looking on the back end. Oh, they’re going to want this kind of data file transfer for us. Well, we can start prepping and pulling everything we need to give to you. Yep. So anything you have there, go ahead and start seeding that to me. And I’ll literally just start parceling that out. I’ll send.
Brandon Chase (31:12) You, the whole thing, man, I’ll send you all of our API documentation. They could go crazy on it. Awesome. I just want to make sure in terms of the integrations, and I do remember talking to you about this and I kind of heard you say this, but I want to make sure that we’re on the same page. We’re not coming out of the gate with an integration, right? We’re like the way that, but here’s the way that I kind of talk about it, I say it’s like a phased approach, right? Phase one is really kind of getting you guys up and running and all of your data into the platform, right? And then we could we even start processing those cred files, phase two or phase one a, whatever you want to call it. That’s when we start having those integration conversations. And I think the reason why it works better that way is because now our technical team has a chance to understand the intricacies of your business and your internal systems and all that stuff. Our teams get to know each other a little bit better. So we have way more context. It’s just so much more accurate that way. And then your team too will be able to determine like, okay, here is the realistic lift that we need to do. Because honestly, man, sometimes it’s like, yeah, we want an integration to xyz system and we’re saying we go. Okay. Well, that’s going to be 10,000 dollars and they’re like, okay, and they sign off on it and our team does the work and then they come back and they’re like we could have done that for free.
Derek Ferrell (32:43) It’s like, yeah.
Brandon Chase (32:45) You could have. So this way it allows your team to assess like what is it that we want to own? And like how many hours is it going to take? And all that stuff, right? Like they’re going to want to know that stuff anyway. So, yeah, I just want to make sure I set.
Derek Ferrell (33:02) That expectation. So we’re aligned because again, the need is we need to, I guess offload’s the wrong word, but we need to fix our credentialing processes. We’re essentially fixing them by I’m cutting out our processes, inserting the medallion, right? And then just taping around the edges back into our collage here. We do need to do that, but I would say that I think it would be phase one of the implementation immediately followed by kind of phase two. In that case. So is phase one, two weeks, is it 30 days for us to get fully up and running like on the tool? Well, then let’s figure it out. Hopefully it’s not 30 days. I don’t think it would be, you know, Troy. I think we got up and running in like two, three weeks. I would think based on our data and from what I’ve seen it’d be pretty similar. Once you give me the template, I can get them to put it in that format. And again, on the bad data piece, I’ll just exclude that because you can’t use it anyways. And then I’ll work on our end on cleaning that up. But there’s not a lot of it now provider data cleanup for eight months. And so we can get that and we can start prospectively. The goal will be once we define, okay, these four buckets or five of providers, you know, these types from this day, April thirtieth or whatever. From here on it all goes to madonna like it doesn’t it’s not coming through our processes. Our processes are that and then, okay, it’s working, everything’s working. How do the apis work? And we immediately transition to say, okay, what’s working? That was the immediate need. We want the apis too because the goal is from a data maintenance standpoint, moving forward, we’re going to have that API to say, hey radnet, you know, one of our big Di groups represents like 700 facilities. They send us like monthly updates on who’s where and what’s going on. We need to be able to push that, push pull through the system. Because if we don’t the manual process of it, what happens now? Which is like we do these like rolling two or three year provider data cleanups that are just all hands on deck nightmares. And then our data is still like 10 percent off like every time. So it.
Brandon Chase (35:21) would be one community followed.
Derek Ferrell (35:23) by the other. I got.
Brandon Chase (35:26) you? Yeah. Well, let’s call it phase one a then because that just sounds better than phase two. And then ivgi is that’s your system of truth? Ivgm. My bad, my bad, that’s the source of truth, right? Like that’s. Got it.
Derek Ferrell (35:44) Yeah. So, we have ivgm. So it’s lowercase I capital vgm, right? Ivgm is the data warehouse that’s where our data is. And then we have a system called viper and viper is our billing processing kind of component. So, viper pulls from ivgm and it pulls the demographic data, contract data from ivgm. So that if I say, hey, Brandon chase is a PT for Brandon chase. PT group. Ivgm is going to have you, it’s going to have your demographic information. It’s going to have your contract saved in it actually attached in the record in ivgm. Most of the time. We’ve been better about it recently.
Derek Ferrell (36:27) That was one thing with us. We were going back through and fixing but has all the data. And then viper says, okay, per the contract, he’s paid at 27 dollars an hour, you know, or this or 85 percent of this. And then it calculates it and then pays out the bills. But as far as credentialing goes, that credentialing data is stored in ivgm, that’s where your cred date’s going to be your re, cred, date’s, going to be your cred status is going to be in there. Hey, are they termed? Are they closed? Are they, you know, other? Are they, you know, any of the others?
Brandon Chase (37:07) Perfect. And then you’re so if we have, so you’re looking for, you want the integration of ivgm, right? Because, correct.
Derek Ferrell (37:16) Because basically.
Brandon Chase (37:17) Yeah.
Derek Ferrell (37:17) So that perfect world, if we just magic wand to get us on the same page here, you know, with the note taker and everything the goal would be provider coming in or historic doesn’t matter but let’s just do new provider for the sake, of ease here, you know, new provider coming in, Brandon chase, PT group, PTS locations, right? Signs we go ahead and they go to the provider portal. On our end. The link that’s in our provider portal is to medallion, right? In that case for credentialing, it’s not our credentialing link like it is currently it auto ones out, you know, automatically single sign on sso out to medallion. They log in. They start going through the application through, medallion credentials. It, it goes through the steps. We use the tool to track it, go through all the various steps, gets approved in committee. And the second we hit approve it apis into ivgm to help create that record in ivgm for a newer group and say, okay, Brandon chase, PT, this is the tax id per the cred app. This was the, this is, this here’s the files. So that because as it is now, I literally have a team, that manually goes in actually manually and says Brandon chase, PT doctor, one doctor, two doctor, three. And you can imagine what that leads to and why we have to do rolling three year and then that’s just on the new end. Well, what about our larger groups and entities? The empower, chiropractics, you know, with right now we only have about 2,500 of their chiros, but we signed all 10,000. Once we go into the other states, they send us monthly rosters and they’re not sending us necessarily ads drops and terminations.
Derek Ferrell (39:07) They send us a monthly roster, right? So they don’t change us terms and everything changes. That would be something where it’s like I’d love for that to be able to say here, it comes through me down here. Are the new ones here’s, the terms, more importantly, you know, how do we process that? Is there a way we can do that through medallion as well. And then just API back in so that we don’t have to track this group anymore. You don’t have to track these five. They’re gone. They sold that location. It’s out medallion. You don’t need it anymore and we don’t either, right, right. So that’s kind of the way we would envision that working because as it is now, it’s manual for us to credential it. It’s manual for us to ingest it. And it’s manual for us to keep it, you know, appropriate. Yeah. Yes. Okay. That just adds to why the whole process takes forever, right? And then even taking forever, it’s not accurate, not manual. Yeah, right. So, we get the, we get the worst of all worlds. In that case. Yeah.
Brandon Chase (40:07) They’re they’re you know, as part of this there, there will probably have to be some kind of like a process mapping or something, and.
Derek Ferrell (40:18) Agreed. I don’t.
Brandon Chase (40:19) I don’t know if you have that right now, if you have like a flow chart or something, but.
Derek Ferrell (40:23) Yeah, man.
Brandon Chase (40:25) How cool. Would that be? If, if like you’re the note taker, like the note taker of the future, it could literally create that flow chart that.
Derek Ferrell (40:32) You create that just from you? Yeah.
Brandon Chase (40:35) That would be, that would be awesome. I don’t if… you don’t have it, it’s okay. It’s so.
Derek Ferrell (40:41) Like I have the sops, mind you. So it’s like, sop, this is how we cred, sop, this is how we data ingest, you know, I don’t have it in a flow, but that doesn’t mean we couldn’t make one. And so certainly, as we go because the other part of that too.
Brandon Chase (41:01) Together our.
Derek Ferrell (41:01) Credit our credit process and sop is based off of how we do it. Well, that whole process is out the window and burned in a fire once medallion comes in, right? So we could have and kind of flow that looks like how it goes and that’s where if you give me your API information and all of that, when it comes across, then I can start giving that to the teams to be like, hey, could you guys put together a flow? Like if you envisioned if they had a magic wand, you know, straight with, the corp, it dev engineer and he has the magic wand. Hey, if you have an API coming in because we do have an API currently in place albeit way less sophisticated than what we envision happening with Formstack. So, Formstack was a vendor kind of partner we partnered with. I don’t even necessarily want to use the term vendor necessarily. But basically what they did was they just online hosted our paper application. Literally, that’s all they did like they copy pasted our paper application, put it in an online kind of form. I mean, formstacks typically used for like large surveys and things like that. Like it’s not typically used for credentialing, right? Right? We would give the Formstack link because as it was before, I would to email you and so our people would like 60 something pages of paperwork and you can imagine how long that would take people to get through. So once it’s completed through Formstack, it sends us a notification that it’s done. And it does push data out to ivgm in its current state. So, I know and mind you it’s not pushing everything. It’s only pushing a small component. It’s not fully integrated. So, I know the capability is there albeit we’re using like 1987 caveman tech, when we could be using like 20 20 at least stuff now. And so I do think that likely we could look at how Formstack is currently working and integrating from an API standpoint. Mind you, I don’t want to replicate what Formstack’s doing because it’s not robust enough for us. But see how it’s integrating because it is working and it’s not broken. It’s been working and they’ve been leveraging it that way for I don’t know eight years now, 10 years. So I know it can, and that’ll be part of that conversation too, where I can say guys, exactly, how would we want the flow to go? How is it going to look? You know, what will it do? But I would love envision perfect world. It would be Brandon chase PT, newer group with us signs. Well, then they go through the cred process. We green light it through cred committee, follow all the steps through the tool and it apis in ibgm creates Brandon chase PT and ibgm through the API. And then here come all the practitioners under it. You know, that’s something we have to discuss too because.
Brandon Chase (43:56) We.
Derek Ferrell (43:57) credit and set up at the facility level. We track all the doctors that are under them, but, you know, even our, in ibgm there might be some changes that have to take place there on how it shows, not how I can pull out data from it but how it shows in there to make sure that it shows like parent child or affiliation, however you want to say it, you know, in the records, yeah, but that’s nothing for you guys to figure out that’ll just be more on our end on the catcher’s mitt side of that data to make sure we’re parsing it appropriately. And we can kind of figure that out too. But again, I do think it’s going to work just fine because it’s already working with Formstack. So if it’s already working with Formstack at the facility level and it’s still passing across that physician data, it’s just not credding like we’re not credding it that we’re collecting it? We’re just not credding it. Well, then if we now credit, can it still come across in the same form? Just maybe slightly different? So that we do and check all boxes appropriately again. Just like a more if this is a one step API with Formstack. Maybe it’s like a four step API whatever with medallion, just to make sure we’re getting everything, I think we can do it. So. Okay.
Brandon Chase (45:06) No, that’s super helpful. You know, I’m glad that, we touched base. I think. Yeah, like I said, what I’ll do is I’ll send you the API documentation and then I’ll send you the file for.
Derek Ferrell (45:20) Yeah.
Brandon Chase (45:21) How, yep, how we want to adjust that data? Yeah. And that’ll kind of kill? Yeah.
Derek Ferrell (45:27) Also send me because we need to start likely collecting data in the format moving forward. Send me your template roster like your standard roster that you’d have a physician fill out or a group fill out because I want to make sure it matches with what we’re collecting from our end. Because that likely, I’m not going to wait on anything. And I’ll just say, hey guys, moving forward, this is now our template roster and make sure that we start collecting it in that format so that when we do hit that green, go live date. Well, then everything just starts coming straight across. We’re already collecting it because I know typically you guys have it on like an excel sheet and then it converts through CSV into the portal. At least that’s how we used it at Troy. And so I just want to make sure we’re already ready to make that jump. So send me that too. So send me what you need for the mpi file transfer. And then I’m going to get you everything. I’m not going to exclude anything, right? It’s going to be the full file as much as I can pull at least that I have the data for. So it’s going to be less than the 42,000, right? Because there’s bad data where I don’t have, I have those people, we have the contract. I just may not have mpi. I may not have some cases, maybe tax id things that would stop you guys from being able to do anything. And it just means it identifies us to go back out and correct it. But I’ll get the full file transferred. We can figure out who in there, which buckets we do, where, and then we go from there. Yeah, that works and then give me the API documentation too. Of course. So, the three eyes yep.
Brandon Chase (47:00) Yep. Those are the three I got too. And then meanwhile, I’ll be working on getting that engagement manager assigned. And then like I said, we’ll have that internal call. Next step from there would be the external kickoff call.
Derek Ferrell (47:14) And they.
Brandon Chase (47:15) May want, I don’t know if they’re gonna go ahead. I was gonna say, I don’t know. I don’t know if they want me and Scott to scope out like, the flow or whatever. But either way, like, we will be making progress toward the implementation either way. So it doesn’t matter. It doesn’t really matter who it is. It’s it just, it matters that it gets done. So.
Derek Ferrell (47:35) Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Awesome. And then once we have that, and again, I’m not going to hold your feet to the fire on this. I’m just trying to figure out timeline wise once we have the engagement manager assigned how quickly on phase one where it’s just leveraging the tool, you know, us. Hey, it’s we’re going to start with PT, can you guys take PT? And we’re now going to push that your way? Even if we don’t we trickle it first before we do all the floodgates right? With the rest. How quickly do you think we can start to get into the tool, start leveraging that even just for prospective versus historic? I.
Brandon Chase (48:16) Mean, the answer that I usually give there’s always an asterisk, right? But just to give you like a general kind of time, it’s like four weeks. Yeah, that’s kind of right? Like, okay, if, and that there’s an asterisk there because it’s like if we have the data we need, if it’s clean, you know, all that stuff. But assuming all that’s true four weeks, could, you know, could it go sooner? It, could, you know, yeah, I’ve seen it. I’ve seen it go in two weeks. You know what I mean? But like is.
Derek Ferrell (48:47) That even is that even just prospective? So setting historic aside, like if I say I’ve got 300 providers that have contracted in the last two weeks that we haven’t credentialed so they’re not historic data. We haven’t credentialed them yet. Can we start pushing those through? If we get the CSV format like as new entities coming up? And again, we don’t I would think those would go pretty quick because I only reason I say that is because it Troy, I mean we were up and running prospective keyword, prospective historic. It took a while because our day was terrible but yeah, prospective, we were up in like seven days, eight days. It was quick. But again, when I say prospective, that was none of our historic stuff that was new stuff coming in basically from like cut rip the band aid off from this date, you can put these new ones through. And that helped us a ton. Because then the next, in fact, we did it in three buckets. So we did prospective first, Bam, and then I did my recreds because at Troy, we had 18,000 providers. At least when medallion first came in, we had about 22 and a half 1,000 I guess when I left but they, it was the recreds. And so we had like 8,000 needing recred. We did those first because our data was so bad. We did those first and then we did the rest of the historic and we were fully up and running and probably 35 days maybe on all three of those. But prospective, I mean, it was like talked on a Monday, we were leveraging it the next Tuesday, you know, Tuesday it was pretty quick and I’m not saying that is what happens here again, but I just know that the more we can offload on some pieces and set up appropriately because the prospective will be what should the process be moving forward? Because we’re I’m literally once we go through this, I’m rewriting our whole sop and saying this is what it is. This is where it’s going and, you know, medallion, how does it work for you? Okay. Well, then this is what it and then stamp delivered done. And then historic, we can figure out and I’ll likely pull out, hey, here’s the ones that have to recred. So if there’s bad data, I’m going to clean these, you guys do these and it’ll come in parcels probably just to help speed this up as well. Okay? Because there’s no reason that you guys should grind your gears and just turn mud if I just credentialed them on our end, you. Know six months ago, you guys probably don’t need that right now, like we can get to that, right? But if.
Brandon Chase (51:17) it’s like that should?
Derek Ferrell (51:18) Speed things up months over well, then, yeah, we need to get them done. So that should.
Brandon Chase (51:24) Speed things up. I mean, I’ll let the team know and I’ll let the team know what you’re thinking. I’ll also ask the question like, hey, yeah.
Derek Ferrell (51:31) And again, you let me know if it goes fast. Yeah, yeah, if, like if we’re going to put the fast button?
Brandon Chase (51:37) What do we do? Yeah, which group do we start with? That kind of thing? Yeah.
Derek Ferrell (51:43) You know?
Brandon Chase (51:44) But I mean, to be fair medallion is a different company. Now, it’s it, you know, it’s like, I agree that’s the thing, right? It’s like, when the, when a company matures a lot of times, there is, there are more processes and stuff like that. They get put into place and it’s all for the better. But sometimes you do sacrifice speed… just throwing that out there too and.
Derek Ferrell (52:04) That’s why I asked that’s why I asked, so what, you know, what is it? Because that’s what I’ve seen that was the experience. So if that’s not what it is. Now, that’s fine. I just want to know because, what I don’t want to have happen is and I haven’t to be clear, said anything like this to leadership to be like, yeah, it’s seven days, nine days that’s what I’ve seen, right? If I say that. And then it takes 30, it’s gonna be hell to pay, right? Right? So that’s the thing like I just want to make sure we’re aligned if the reasonable expectation is, if you could. Derek if you can give me this data in this format and this is where we start 10 days, you know, two weeks two, whatever this is. This is. Then we can prospective keyword because I do think we need to break it into brackets. Let’s start to offload some of it on the process. Can we just get the newer providers in these specialty types offloaded? Okay? Now we’ll all know these specialty types. Okay? Now we’re gonna do historic in these specialty types that need recred, then we’re gonna do the rest of the historic likely, but I can get you the full file in the meantime, and then we can kind of decide where to pick and choose because if we try to do the whole thing, I think it’s just gonna drag on a lot longer than it probably needs to when the need is like we have a desperate need to get this going. So let’s get it going where we need it and then roll the rest on. Yeah. So, yeah, I.
Brandon Chase (53:25) think that’s I think that’s smart. Cool. All right. I got my marching orders and I’ll get you the stuff that you need. And we, like I said, we’ll be, I’ll be in touch as soon as I know who your em is. And then we’ll get this process started one way or another.
Derek Ferrell (53:41) Awesome. Sounds good. Cool. And then also so you’re aware, so I’ll start making introductions on my side as needed. So don’t get, you know, squeamish when if I’m like, hey here’s, Christopher Peterson who’s the manager over the credentialing and data teams because he needs to start getting involved because his teams are going to be the ones leveraging it or hey here’s so, and so from the data team or the dev team or corp, it or corp security, again, they’ll be the three up there, dev corp, it and corp security. I will start making introductions to those groups if it’s not with you or whoever it needs to be, just point in the right direction. But just so you’re aware just so that I can get the word out there to everyone, get the right people in the rooms for each of their prospective parts of the business, so that we do get the right people just asking me and I’m like, yeah, let me go check on that or let me go put in that request. Then you can talk straight to the person and it’s like, no, I actually need it in this format.
Brandon Chase (54:38) Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Well, and I’ll send you like, you know, you’ll get an agenda ahead of time and all that stuff like here’s what to expect, on this call. So you can know, all right, I want to invite this person and that person, right? So that way we can start kind of intermingling the team. So, you know, you, me and you know, whoever are not bottlenecks, you know, to what needs to happen. So.
Derek Ferrell (55:00) Yeah, sounds good.
Brandon Chase (55:01) That makes sense. All right, cool. Derek, I appreciate it, man. Thank you so much. We’re looking forward to working together and getting this thing going. And, I will, I know the, you know, the timeline here needs to be quick, you know, as quickly as possible and it’s.
Derek Ferrell (55:21) quick, it’s quick for like the necessary ones. And again, not, yeah, again because expediency just for expediency’s sake doesn’t do anyone good. It’s more just like where can we offload? Because the process isn’t good. Now we are building a backlog and we are, so it’s like the boat is sinking. It’s sinking slowly but it’s sinking. So let’s stop the boat from sinking and let’s work on fixing the boat, right? So that’s why I said once I get that file, I’ll get it over to you. We’ll decide where we start and that will be kind of like mutual decision. It’s not just going to be me being like, yeah, it’s here. Now, I will tell you like this pain point’s worse than this pain point. So maybe if we can, you know, do this one first and then we can look at the rest and then his store again recred, we’re going to have to because I’m seeding providers. So our protocols are if they don’t recreate within 90 days after we’re starting to term them or 60 days. So we give them a 90 90 60, 30 day warning and then 30 60 post. But at 60 we start, our system will literally start turning. And so we’ve been just, bleeding and it shouldn’t be right. It shouldn’t be right. He says they are reaching out to credit with us and we’re just not like getting to it per SE. So anywho, appreciate your time, look forward to working with you. Get me those. And then I’ll also work on my end on putting together because I know our side’s gonna want to see like an implementation plan and that kind of stuff. So I’ll start throwing together what I think it should look like. Certainly from your end start to do the same as I know you likely will share that once ready and we’ll get rolling on that piece too. So I can share it with Gail and likely that’ll go up to Danny. I don’t think anything from here on will go to bat but color me surprised if it does as a kind of like a check in. Yeah. Again, it really should be just me, I think from here on maybe Gail occasionally. And then whoever else needs, you know, Chris Peterson over the teams because he’s the manager. Likely someone Anthony Flores from our data team is director of data analytics. I’m sure he’ll get involved. Likely someone from dev, maybe corp, it corp security. Working more on the pieces, maybe several, you know, could be four or five of them. I don’t know who they bring in on that one yet, but I’ll let you know, cool. Sounds good. Awesome. Appreciate you. Yeah.
Brandon Chase (57:42) Thanks, Derek. Appreciate you too all.
Derek Ferrell (57:44) Right. Yeah, we’ll see you.